DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length?

RichA wrote:
> "DSLRs for Dummies"

Um, yeah. Maybe my follow-up to David makes it a bit clearer.

> Seriously, do pro cameras ever have "idiot" modes?
> You know, like a little face logo for portraits, a mountain for
> landscapes, etc?
> When you see that on a Nikon D2Xs, you'll know their days are
> numbered.

Mind you, that's a great spot for user-programmed profiles (I
believe the pro models do this). But the factory-set ones on prosumers
are a waste of space.
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

Richard H. wrote:
> Do any DSLRs offer a mode to auto-adjust the shutter speed proportionate
> to the focal length? (i.e., if I zoom out to 2x the FOV, cut the
> shutter speed by 1/2 and open the aperture by 2x)
>
> When shooting motorsports, the ideal shutter speed is a balance between
> freezing the subject and conveying motion (e.g., blurred tires or panned
> background). Not a problem when using a fixed lens, but a problem if
> zooming in/out. (i.e., 1/2000 freezes more at 70mm than at 200mm).
>
> Do models like 1DsII or D2Xs offer such a feature? If so, what's it
> called?
>


Yes, it is built in to the P mode (Program). For the last twenty years
or more, P mode has been linked to focal length in all SLRs, whether pro
or amateur.

The camera can not tell whether you are shooting sports (unless it has a
sports mode, which tends not to happen in pro models). But it can tell
what focal length your are using, and will keep the shutter speed as
short as possible at longer settings.

David
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

David Kilpatrick wrote:
> Yes, it is built in to the P mode (Program). For the last twenty years
> or more, P mode has been linked to focal length in all SLRs, whether pro
> or amateur.

Hi, David.

Thanks for the reply. You're correct, of course. What I had in mind is
very similar, but a bit of a hybrid.

Put another way... Program mode but with a static exposure value,
instead of auto-metering. (Like Nikon's AE Lock behavour, but without
it being reset every time the meter turns off.) Ideally, it'd work with
shutter-priority or manual (my preferred mode).

The idea being to set the EV based on incident light (so different
vehicle colors don't skew the metering) but preserve the visual effect
by adjusting shutter speed across a range of focal lengths.

Cheers,
Richard
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

"RichA" <rander3127.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1185066764.227959.225940@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 21, 8:33 pm, "Richard H." <r....RemoveThis@no.spam> wrote:
>> Do any DSLRs offer a mode to auto-adjust the shutter speed proportionate
>> to the focal length? (i.e., if I zoom out to 2x the FOV, cut the
>> shutter speed by 1/2 and open the aperture by 2x)
>>
>> When shooting motorsports, the ideal shutter speed is a balance between
>> freezing the subject and conveying motion (e.g., blurred tires or panned
>> background). Not a problem when using a fixed lens, but a problem if
>> zooming in/out. (i.e., 1/2000 freezes more at 70mm than at 200mm).
>>
>> Do models like 1DsII or D2Xs offer such a feature? If so, what's it
>> called?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Richard
>
> "DSLRs for Dummies"
>
> Seriously, do pro cameras ever have "idiot" modes?
> You know, like a little face logo for portraits, a mountain for
> landscapes, etc?
> When you see that on a Nikon D2Xs, you'll know their days are
> numbered.

I assume that program mode on the decent ones can be "programmed" to do what
you you need, mine can.
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

Pete D wrote:
> I assume that program mode on the decent ones can be "programmed" to do what
> you you need, mine can.

Hi, Pete.

Which camera are you shooting with, and how much can the Program-mode
behavior be customized?

Cheers,
Richard
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

"Richard H." <rh86.TakeThisOut@no.spam> wrote in message
news:QhCoi.24073$QF3.5414@newsfe13.phx...
> Pete D wrote:
>> I assume that program mode on the decent ones can be "programmed" to do
>> what you you need, mine can.
>
> Hi, Pete.
>
> Which camera are you shooting with, and how much can the Program-mode
> behavior be customized?
>
> Cheers,
> Richard

My K10D has four settings in hyper program mode.

1. Normal
2. Hi speed
3. Depth of field
4. MTF priority program is an AE mode that priorities the best aperture
setting for the attached lens.

Cheers.

Pete
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

"Richard H." <rh86 DeleteThis @no.spam> wrote in message
news:zfCoi.23953$QF3.2103@newsfe13.phx...
> David Kilpatrick wrote:
>> Yes, it is built in to the P mode (Program). For the last twenty years or
>> more, P mode has been linked to focal length in all SLRs, whether pro or
>> amateur.
>
> Hi, David.
>
> Thanks for the reply. You're correct, of course. What I had in mind is
> very similar, but a bit of a hybrid.
>
> Put another way... Program mode but with a static exposure value, instead
> of auto-metering. (Like Nikon's AE Lock behavour, but without it being
> reset every time the meter turns off.) Ideally, it'd work with
> shutter-priority or manual (my preferred mode).
>
> The idea being to set the EV based on incident light (so different vehicle
> colors don't skew the metering) but preserve the visual effect by
> adjusting shutter speed across a range of focal lengths.
So you mean a "motion blur priority" mode? Kind of like shutter priority,
but instead of keeping the shutter fixed, it maintains the shutter speed
relative to the FL? so if the camera is at 100mm and I set the shutter to be
1/50, it would move up to 1/150 if I zoomed to 300mm. Can't say I know of
any that do it - shutter priority and dialling the shutter speed while you
zoom would be the closest. Not all that hard to do.
>
> Cheers,
> Richard
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

Richard H. wrote:
> David Kilpatrick wrote:
>
>> Yes, it is built in to the P mode (Program). For the last twenty years
>> or more, P mode has been linked to focal length in all SLRs, whether
>> pro or amateur.
>
>
> Hi, David.
>
> Thanks for the reply. You're correct, of course. What I had in mind is
> very similar, but a bit of a hybrid.
>
> Put another way... Program mode but with a static exposure value,
> instead of auto-metering. (Like Nikon's AE Lock behavour, but without
> it being reset every time the meter turns off.) Ideally, it'd work with
> shutter-priority or manual (my preferred mode).
>
> The idea being to set the EV based on incident light (so different
> vehicle colors don't skew the metering) but preserve the visual effect
> by adjusting shutter speed across a range of focal lengths.
>
>

Pentax has one similar thing and I suspect Samsung does. It's a mode
where you set both shutter speed and aperture, and the ISO is varied,
and when you reach the limit of the ISO (which you can pre-set to avoid
using too low or high for the conditions) the camera will then alter the
other parameters.

However, I do not know of any camera which alters the plus-minus EV
setting to cope with changes in the colour of a car - just manual mode.

Nikon's better cameras use an external WB sensor on the prism, which
avoids auto WB errors being caused by a coloured subject filling the
frame. They do not use this sensor for exposure moderation though.

Your idea is fundamentally a good one - an external incident light
sensor on a probe, maybe, mounted on the hot shoe, to control the camera
according to the light conditions - sun going in etc - and not using TTL
metering.

So far it doesn't exist. Minolta bought in patents on a Zone System
viewfinder display which allowed the use to target one of seven zones,
and the camera would expose to match. They never used it.

David
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

Doug Jewell wrote:
> So you mean a "motion blur priority" mode? Kind of like shutter
> priority, but instead of keeping the shutter fixed, it maintains the
> shutter speed relative to the FL? so if the camera is at 100mm and I set
> the shutter to be 1/50, it would move up to 1/150 if I zoomed to 300mm.
> Can't say I know of any that do it - shutter priority and dialling the
> shutter speed while you zoom would be the closest. Not all that hard to do.

Bingo!

I tend to shoot in manual mode, so I envision it as a menu option rather
than a button, akin to "Track shutter speed with focal length". A bit
of a hybrid between Program and Manual modes, if you will. (An
alternative might be to allow a manual EV setting with Program mode.)

Certainly this feature would be off by default - it's not the behavior
anyone would normally expect when manually setting the shutter speed.

Alas, it sounds like this might be a pipedream. Unfortunate, knowing
that it'd be pretty easily implemented. Maybe one day camera firmware
will go open source, and we can tweak away.

Cheers,
Richard
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

On Jul 22, 11:26 am, John Sheehy <J....TakeThisOut@no.komm> wrote:
> RichA <rander3....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote innews:1185066764.227959.225940@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Seriously, do pro cameras ever have "idiot" modes?
> > You know, like a little face logo for portraits, a mountain for
> > landscapes, etc?
> > When you see that on a Nikon D2Xs, you'll know their days are
> > numbered.
>
> There's nothing "Dummies" or "Idiot" about the OP's request. It is a
> very logical feature that I desired as soon as I got back into
> photography a few years ago. In very low light, doing hand-held
> shooting, Av mode is extremely problematic. I tend to use Av mode when
> there is ample light for fast shutter speeds, and Tv mode when light is
> very low, and having a blurred long exposure is worse than having wide-
> open optics or a little under-exposure. The logical extension to the
> latter is to have a Tv-pri mode where you set a ratio to focal length,
> rather than a fixed focal length, very useful for zoom cameras, so you
> don't get unnecessary under-exposure at the wide end of the zoom range.
>
> An intelligent photographer can make good use of automation to their
> advantage, when they choose one that automates what *they* would do
> automatically, if they had remembered to do so and had the time.
>
> This feature would be more of a true "user-control" than the P mode,
> which the Pro cameras do have.

Any such mode (like other such modes) would be only the roughest guess
at what would be needed.
There is no way you could ever make it even marginally precise. How
does the camera know how fast the action is?
Maybe in the future, a system of sensor feedback (could the sensor
detect subject motion?) accelerometers in-camera could be used to
facilitate something more accurate.
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

On Jul 22, 7:40 pm, John Sheehy <J....TakeThisOut@no.komm> wrote:

> I'm not sure what you're implying here, but focal length has no effect on
> subject blur, at a given shutter speed. Someone swinging a golf club at
> 1/100 will have the same angular blur at 8mm or 1200mm.
>
> I'd want a feature like you mention, but I'd want it for static or slow-
> moving subjects in compromised light (to avoid wasteful underexposure when
> zooming out).

Sure it does: speed of image on sensor=speed of subject*magnification,
and magnification depends on the focal length (amongst other things).

Or thing of taking a photo of an airplane passing at a distance of
200m with a) a 10mm lens and b) a 1000mm lens, everything else the
same.
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

On Jul 22, 10:56 pm, acl <achilleaslazari... DeleteThis @yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>
> Or thing

THINK!!!
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length? 

RichA <rander3127.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1185066764.227959.225940@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:

> Seriously, do pro cameras ever have "idiot" modes?
> You know, like a little face logo for portraits, a mountain for
> landscapes, etc?
> When you see that on a Nikon D2Xs, you'll know their days are
> numbered.

There's nothing "Dummies" or "Idiot" about the OP's request. It is a
very logical feature that I desired as soon as I got back into
photography a few years ago. In very low light, doing hand-held
shooting, Av mode is extremely problematic. I tend to use Av mode when
there is ample light for fast shutter speeds, and Tv mode when light is
very low, and having a blurred long exposure is worse than having wide-
open optics or a little under-exposure. The logical extension to the
latter is to have a Tv-pri mode where you set a ratio to focal length,
rather than a fixed focal length, very useful for zoom cameras, so you
don't get unnecessary under-exposure at the wide end of the zoom range.

An intelligent photographer can make good use of automation to their
advantage, when they choose one that automates what *they* would do
automatically, if they had remembered to do so and had the time.

This feature would be more of a true "user-control" than the P mode,
which the Pro cameras do have.

--

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <JPS.RemoveThis@no.komm>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
 >> Stay informed about: DSLR that adjusts shutter speed w/ focal length?