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Sigma lies about DP1

 
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Sosumi

External


Since: Jul 26, 2007
Posts: 127



(Msg. 1) Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:00 pm
Post subject: Sigma lies about DP1
Archived from groups: aus>photo, others (more info?)

Is everyone asleep here?
The "new" Sigma DP1 was also announced "new" in 2006:

http://www.ephotozine.com/article/Sigma-SD14--DP1---Hands-on-preview

So much for the truth the Sigma way. True: a very unique camera; I've never
seen a new camera introduced twice two years apart.

And more lies:

http://www.sigmaphoto.com/downloads/SD14_SpecSheet_English.pdf

RAW images are 2640 x 1760 PIXELS. Yet they claim 14 MP because it can
produce a 14 MP JPEG.

Sure, then the Nikon D80 should be called a 30 MP camera, because it's raw
files can easily reach that with software.


--
Sosumi

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nospam

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Since: Feb 16, 2006
Posts: 635



(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Sigma lies about DP1 [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

In article <6LudnW5556EGhzranZ2dnUVZ8hydnZ2d.DeleteThis@novis.pt>, Sosumi
<sosumi.DeleteThis@home.nl> wrote:

> The "new" Sigma DP1 was also announced "new" in 2006:
>
> So much for the truth the Sigma way. True: a very unique camera; I've never
> seen a new camera introduced twice two years apart.

announced, discontinued, scrapped and re-announced. surprisingly, it
still is listed as discontinued:
<http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details
&Q=&sku=472377&is=REG>

> RAW images are 2640 x 1760 PIXELS. Yet they claim 14 MP because it can
> produce a 14 MP JPEG.

actually, they claim 14 because each pixel has three layers. they
added the 14 meg 'super hi' jpeg mode to justify its 14 mp claim.

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Mr. Strat

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Since: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 310



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Sigma lies about DP1 [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

In article <6LudnW5556EGhzranZ2dnUVZ8hydnZ2d RemoveThis @novis.pt>, Sosumi
<sosumi RemoveThis @home.nl> wrote:

> RAW images are 2640 x 1760 PIXELS. Yet they claim 14 MP because it can
> produce a 14 MP JPEG.
>
> Sure, then the Nikon D80 should be called a 30 MP camera, because it's raw
> files can easily reach that with software.

Sigma lying? Surely you jest. I'm guessing that there are more Zunes
sold than Sigma cameras, so not they're not screwing that many people.
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Neil Ellwood

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Since: Dec 26, 2007
Posts: 30



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Sigma lies about DP1 [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Mon, 04 Feb 2008 14:00:57 +0000, Sosumi wrote:

> Is everyone asleep here?
> The "new" Sigma DP1 was also announced "new" in 2006:

Not asleep. Just don't need to know.
--
Neil
reverse ra and delete l
Linux user 335851
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Eric Miller

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Since: Dec 14, 2006
Posts: 20



(Msg. 5) Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Sigma lies about DP1 [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital, others (more info?)

Sosumi wrote:
> Is everyone asleep here?
> The "new" Sigma DP1 was also announced "new" in 2006:
>
> http://www.ephotozine.com/article/Sigma-SD14--DP1---Hands-on-preview
>
> So much for the truth the Sigma way. True: a very unique camera; I've never
> seen a new camera introduced twice two years apart.
>
> And more lies:
>
> http://www.sigmaphoto.com/downloads/SD14_SpecSheet_English.pdf
>
> RAW images are 2640 x 1760 PIXELS. Yet they claim 14 MP because it can
> produce a 14 MP JPEG.
>
> Sure, then the Nikon D80 should be called a 30 MP camera, because it's raw
> files can easily reach that with software.
>
>


Sosuthem

I couldn't resist.

Eric Miller
www.dyesscreek.com
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Wolfgang Weisselberg

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Since: Nov 03, 2005
Posts: 75



(Msg. 6) Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 12:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Sigma lies about DP1 [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: aus>photo, others (more info?)

["Followup-To:" header set to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems.]
Sosumi <sosumi.TakeThisOut@home.nl> wrote:
> Is everyone asleep here?

No, everyone else knows Sigma's Foveon chip and their
cameras. I remember a guy which was even a bit more rabidly and
uncompromisingly pro-Foveon as Rita (if that can be
imagined). Just mention it and he'd pop up.

In difference to Rita he actually had a brain (even working quite
well) in other areas, like, oh, intricacies of JPEG encoding.
(As in tweaking such things, not just book knowledge.)

> And more lies:

> http://www.sigmaphoto.com/downloads/SD14_SpecSheet_English.pdf

> RAW images are 2640 x 1760 PIXELS. Yet they claim 14 MP because it can
> produce a 14 MP JPEG.

Well, if you would shift the red, green and blue pixels to be
adjacent instead of superpositioned on top of each other, you
get ... 14MP. Which is true enough for marketing (and more
than good enough for any claims Rita would offer regarding
Nikon superiority.)

Pixels, however, do not necessarily count spatial resolution.[1]
Do a Fourier transfomation of some of your images, and look at
the high frequency content. You'll probably find ~70% (ca.
1/SQRT(2)) of the theoretical range actually having content.
That would be basically the distance between 2 green bayer pixels.

Hence, downscaling the image to half the size (70% lenght and 70%
width) will not cause data loss --- or, the other way round,
the 2640x1760 (4.6 Mpix) Foveon should have about the same
*spatial* resolution as a 3734x2489 (9 MPix) Bayer filter camera.
That assumes no unrecoverable blurring on the Foveon, and standard
AA filtering and Bayer restoration on the Bayer filter.
Hence the Sensor should be compared against 8-10MPix Bayer sensors.


When it comes to comparing red and blue colour spatiality,
the Foveon technology is quite ahead of Bayer technology.
The DP1 *has* 2640 x 1760 red sensors, while a conventional Bayer
sensor would need to have 18.6 MPix for the same amount of red
sensors --- and the same is true for blue sensors. Which should
(theoretically!) make Foveon superior when it comes creating B/W
images using mostly red and blue channel data.

OTOH Foveon has severa problems, like colour seperation and
sensor noise at higher gain, which do counteract these inherent
advantages in many cases.


> Sure, then the Nikon D80 should be called a 30 MP camera, because it's raw
> files can easily reach that with software.

No, there simply are no 30 million measured and recorded values.
(not that some ... Ritas ... would be stopped by such small
things.)
There are, however, 14 million measured and recorded values with
the Sigma.

-Wolfgang

[1] Nor are pixels necessarily square, for that matter!
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