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Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use?

 
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ASAAR

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Since: Aug 02, 2005
Posts: 3968



(Msg. 16) Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 4:32 pm
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital (more info?)

On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:01:29 -0500, Ron Hunter wrote:

> You would have enjoyed the cruise I was just on. People from over 60
> countries were the cruise ship staff. In almost all cases their English
> was very good, even understanding jokes. I guess English is becoming
> the world-wide language. Now if someone would just explain that to our
> 'uninvited guests' from Mexico... sigh.

I don't see that the same way, but maybe location makes a
difference. Here, there are many Hispanics, even a good number of
Mexicans. I'm sure that there are many that don't speak English,
but I don't encounter them. The ones that I do, such as store
owners or those working the registers all speak at least passable
English, and usually pick up cues so that they speak English to me.
I prefer the few times that they don't get it right, as it often
helps add a word or two of Spanish to my vocabulary.

BTW, I haven't seen any episodes of ABC's new show Ugly Betty so I
don't know if it has any Spanish references, but it is derived from
the world-wide hit from several years ago "Betty la Fea" from (I
think) Colombia, which had a large cast of very good actors and
actresses. Good enough so that even though I don't speak Spanish,
it was fairly easy to follow much of what was happening, and much of
the show's humor came through. I don't know how faithful the new
version is to the original, but knowing USA TV, the one character
they'd be least likely to eliminate would be the good looking blonde
bimbo, sort of a Wile Coyote character, whose every scheme quickly
backfires. Smile

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Dimitris M

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Since: Mar 15, 2006
Posts: 35



(Msg. 17) Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:47 pm
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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No Paul. The ???? has a self discharge of about 10% during the first day
after charge and after that about 30% per month. This is for new well
preserved batteries. If you have old batteries, for example two year old,
then a 1st month self discharge could be even 60% without this battery been
necessarily defective. Don't forget that self discharge specs are measured
in 20 C temp and is much-much worst in real life. Take a look in the
diagram.
http://www.starbatteries.com/seldisrat.html or google as "MiMH self
discharge rate"

The new technology NiMH batteries can be a little better. The best new
batteries in the market just 3 moths ago could have a 1st month self
discharge of 25 to 30%. But as you understand, Tommy's batteries are not as
new.

Sanyo who leads battery technology has just introduce a new technology that
promises self discharge of 15% per year (Sanyo eneloop).
http://www.eneloop.info/home_en.html
--
Dimitris M


? "Paul Rubin"

>
> The cell is defective or has gone bad if the self-discharge rate is
> that high.

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editor

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Since: Jul 23, 2006
Posts: 52



(Msg. 18) Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:01 am
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Not in my experience with Promaster brand NiMH "AA" rechargeables.
They keep charge in my carry-everywhere digicam - and are ready to go
when needed.

No $4 to park! No $6 admission! http://www.INTERNET-GUN-SHOW.com
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John Turco

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Since: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 1086



(Msg. 19) Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 3:06 am
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Dimitris M wrote:
>
> Paul has give the right advice. All the other advices are wrong. I will try
> to explain with my poor english what happened with the MiMH. (BTW, I am
> electrononics engineer)

Hello, Dimitris:

Your English is okay, and a lot better than my Greek. Smile

<edited, for brevity>

> 4. ALL the MiMH chargers charge the batteries independently, not in series.
> I insist: ALL. If one charges the batteries in series, then the designer and
> the builder of that charger must be "executed" as criminals Wink
> --
> Dimitris M

<edited>

Rather drastic, no? <g>


Cordially,
John Turco <jtur RemoveThis @concentric.net>
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Mike

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Since: Oct 25, 2006
Posts: 1



(Msg. 20) Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:54 am
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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I have one of the MaHa 'smart' chargers. Sometimes it will try to refuse to
charge batteries. This is indicated by a short charge cycle (a few seconds)
followed by a quick switch to trickle. When this happens, I hit the
discharge button which almost immediately switches to charge and then to
trickle. After a few (3 or 4) iterations, it charges normally. If I
attempt to use the batteries after one 'full' charge, they usually prove to
be inadequately charged. So, after the supposed first full charge, I
immediately discharge and recharge them using the charger. Then they work
ok until I let them sit too long.

Mike

"Paul Rubin" <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote in message
news:7x3b9f95z6.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com...
> TommyC <m.DeleteThis@nope.qrs> writes:
>> So my question is, can a battery (in this case, two batteries) just go
>> dead and not take a charge after only four months of no use or charging?
>
> Sometimes "smart" chargers think the cell is shorted or they don't
> even notice a totally discharged cell, so the cell doesn't get
> charged. You could try a "dumb" charger to get some charge back into
> the cell, maybe doing a slow overnight charge.
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Ron Baird

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Since: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 138



(Msg. 21) Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:19 am
Post subject: Re: Can NiMH batteries "just die" from non-use? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Greetings Tommy,

Due to the nature of their chemistry, Ni-MH batteries perform better when
used regularly.

When they are not used, their internal chemicals can crystallize. This is
very similar to how a jar of honey that has sat on the shelf a long time can
crystallize. The crystallized part of the battery does not hold a charge
and therefore reduces the overall charge capacity of the battery.

Also, in the case of honey, you can heat the jar to un-crystallize it. For
the Ni-MH batteries, a conditioning process will help reverse the
crystallization and increase the capacity for holding a charge. disipating
the charge and recharging should return your batteries to normal. It may
take a few charges to complete this process.

Best Regards,

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company



"TommyC" <m.TakeThisOut@nope.qrs> wrote in message
news:m-B50165.21155122102006@syrcnyrdrs-02-ge0.nyroc.rr.com...
> Four months ago, I got a new camera with a proprietary lithium battery
> and have used that exclusively since.
>
> Today, my wife and I both had something to go to, so I took the new
> camera and my wife took the old one. Of course it didn't work when I
> checked it yesterday, so of course I recharged the four NiMH batteries
> that were in it.
>
> When I put the batteries in the charger, two of the charger lights came
> on, but two didn't (indicating that those batteries weren't charging).
> I switched the batteries around, and the same batteries (now in
> different compartments) again didn't make the lights come on.
>
> I should have questioned that right there. Instead, I sent my wife off
> with the camera (which turned on okay yesterday with the batteries in
> it), and after about four shots, the camera died.
>
> So my question is, can a battery (in this case, two batteries) just go
> dead and not take a charge after only four months of no use or charging?
> And if not, what other explanation could there be for the batteries to
> not "light the lights" in the charger?
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