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Decent alternative to dslr?

 
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bugbear

External


Since: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 379



(Msg. 31) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 12:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital, others (more info?)

Henry wrote:
> Hi
>
>
> First, let me pre-empt the flame brigade by saying that I *have* done a lot
> of on-line research in an attempt to reach a decision - but I'd like some
> thoughts from people who might have hands-on experience.
>
> I've been using dslrs for about three years now - or rather *not* using
> them because I very often just can't face all the hassle of carting the
> necessary paraphernalia around with me.
>
> I know all the IQ advantages of a dslr over a P&S but I 'd still like
> something easily transportable and generally less 'fussy'
>
> So my question is, which is the *best* non-dslr camera out there below 500
> GBP??
>
> I'd define *best* for my purposes as
>
> 1 - image quality - the lowest noise possible up to 800 iso
>
> 2 - features - optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual control as
> possible, decent lens.
>
> 3 - size - doesn't have to be 'micro' but generally small and easy to carry
> around.
>
> 4 - build quality - as rugged as possible

How "much" zoom do you want?

BugBear

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NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS

External


Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 32) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS - AT IT AGAIN!


On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 08:36:27 -0800, newsmb.DeleteThis@plcom.net wrote:

>On Nov 5, 9:31 am, SMS · <scharf.ste....DeleteThis@geemail.com> wrote:
>> Henry wrote:
>> > TIA Henry
>>
>> I guess the G9 would be the best choice.
>>
>> To many people, it's not just the superior image quality of the D-SLR,
>> it's the lack of shutter lag that drives them to get a D-SLR rather than
>> a P&S.
>
>
>The G9 is a great product but my feeling on these things is that I
>would much rather have a small DSLR like the Olympus E-410 than any
>large point & shoot, 100% of the time. I am sure there are
>environments where the stealth and quiet operation of the G9 make it a
>better tool, but for my purposes it isn't really enough of a solution
>to a problem to get me to go out and spend $580 (which is the street
>price of the G9 in Canada).

Quick! Which part of the topic of "Decent ALTERNATIVES to dslr?" do you fail to
understand?

All of you DSLR proponents just keep proving the same thing over and over again.
You can't even comprehend a simple topic title, let alone have any respect nor
consideration for anyone else's choices and needs in life. This only goes to
prove again that DSLR buyers are totally unaware and inconsiderate idiots. Hell,
just the noise of their DSLRs is enough to show the world how inconsiderate they
are to everyone. Now that we have ascertained that that is true, that DSLR
proponents = inconsiderate unaware idiots, then it also follows that if DSLR
idiots can't even understand a simple topic title then anything they have to say
about DSLRs is just as ludicrous and absurd.

At least you've all made THAT perfectly clear about the kind of people that
choose DSLRs, why they choose them, and the stupidity of any advice they might
ever offer to anyone about anything.

Thanks!

You do your group SO proud. Smile

You NEVER fail to prove this about yourselves. Anyone could make a fortune by
betting on the stupidity of DSLR buyers. It's that certain of a bet.

Watch them prove it yet again ....

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Pboud

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Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 5



(Msg. 33) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

> NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS - AT IT AGAIN!
>
>
> On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 08:36:27 -0800, newsmb DeleteThis @plcom.net wrote:
>
>> On Nov 5, 9:31 am, SMS · <scharf.ste... DeleteThis @geemail.com> wrote:
>>> Henry wrote:
>>>> TIA Henry
>>> I guess the G9 would be the best choice.
>>>
>>> To many people, it's not just the superior image quality of the D-SLR,
>>> it's the lack of shutter lag that drives them to get a D-SLR rather than
>>> a P&S.
>>
>> The G9 is a great product but my feeling on these things is that I
>> would much rather have a small DSLR like the Olympus E-410 than any
>> large point & shoot, 100% of the time. I am sure there are
>> environments where the stealth and quiet operation of the G9 make it a
>> better tool, but for my purposes it isn't really enough of a solution
>> to a problem to get me to go out and spend $580 (which is the street
>> price of the G9 in Canada).
>
>
<snip rant>
I like the G series, up to the G6.. They went to a micro lens after that
and removed RAW support (though it's back in 9, as I understand)

I still own a G2 and an S3.. The S series is also very nice, with the
12x optical zoom. I've had nothing but good things with it, and it takes
AA batteries so those are nice and simple to swap in/out.

Both fit nicely in a pocket, though I'd tend towards the G series if I
had to choose.

Smile
P.
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NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS

External


Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 34) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 17:07:55 GMT, NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS - AT IT AGAIN!
<nospamforme.RemoveThis@antispam.net> wrote:

>NEWS FLASH - DSLR IDIOTS - AT IT AGAIN!
>
>
>On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 08:36:27 -0800, newsmb.RemoveThis@plcom.net wrote:
>
>>On Nov 5, 9:31 am, SMS · <scharf.ste....RemoveThis@geemail.com> wrote:
>>> Henry wrote:
>>> > TIA Henry
>>>
>>> I guess the G9 would be the best choice.
>>>
>>> To many people, it's not just the superior image quality of the D-SLR,
>>> it's the lack of shutter lag that drives them to get a D-SLR rather than
>>> a P&S.
>>
>>
>>The G9 is a great product but my feeling on these things is that I
>>would much rather have a small DSLR like the Olympus E-410 than any
>>large point & shoot, 100% of the time. I am sure there are
>>environments where the stealth and quiet operation of the G9 make it a
>>better tool, but for my purposes it isn't really enough of a solution
>>to a problem to get me to go out and spend $580 (which is the street
>>price of the G9 in Canada).
>
>Quick! Which part of the topic of "Decent ALTERNATIVES to dslr?" do you fail to
>understand?
>
>All of you DSLR proponents just keep proving the same thing over and over again.
>You can't even comprehend a simple topic title, let alone have any respect nor
>consideration for anyone else's choices and needs in life. This only goes to
>prove again that DSLR buyers are totally unaware and inconsiderate idiots. Hell,
>just the noise of their DSLRs is enough to show the world how inconsiderate they
>are to everyone. Now that we have ascertained that that is true, that DSLR
>proponents = inconsiderate unaware idiots, then it also follows that if DSLR
>idiots can't even understand a simple topic title then anything they have to say
>about DSLRs is just as ludicrous and absurd.
>
>At least you've all made THAT perfectly clear about the kind of people that
>choose DSLRs, why they choose them, and the stupidity of any advice they might
>ever offer to anyone about anything.
>
>Thanks!
>
>You do your group SO proud. Smile
>
>You NEVER fail to prove this about yourselves. Anyone could make a fortune by
>betting on the stupidity of DSLR buyers. It's that certain of a bet.
>
>Watch them prove it yet again ....


HAHAHAHA....

Silly me! I forget, someone already IS making a fortune by betting on the
stupidity of DSLR buyers! Every camera manufacturer that sells DSLRs and the
lenses required for them! LOL
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Henry

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Since: Nov 04, 2007
Posts: 4



(Msg. 35) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Wilba" <wilba.DeleteThis@CUTTHISimago.com.au> wrote in message
news:fgmjro$pt$1@news-01.bur.connect.com.au...
> Henry wrote:
>>
>> 2 - features - optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual
>> control as possible, decent lens.
>
> I'm interested why an optical VF is a must-have?
>
> True, the electronic VF in my Olympus C-770 is a complete waste of time
> for manually focusing on a subject, so if manual focus is an issue, it
> makes sense (if it works better with an optical VF - I don't know).
>
> OTOH, having a histogram in the viewfinder is brilliant - something the
> DSLR brigade seem not to appreciate. Smile <<



Sorry - I unintentionally misled you. although an 'optical' (as in
'looking through glass') VF would be nice, I'm not averse to a good EVF.

What I don't want in *no* VF at all - which seems to be a growing trend, I
couldn't bear holding out the camera at arm's length to see the shot on the
rear LCD (although lots of people seem perfectly happy with that
arrangement)

My memories of EVF's are of fairly grainy images that gave you a general
picture (no pun intended) of the scene, but were not much good for focus or
detailed framing.

Perhaps EVF's have improved in the last few years?, I suppose they must
have.

Thanks again to everyone for their interest and advice - although (in true
Usenet style) I can see a flame war beginning to bubble up Wink Mind you, I
rather like a forum where people are free to speak their minds, some of the
moderated photo chat rooms can so artificially polite that it becomes almost
unbearable.
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Patrick H.

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Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 7



(Msg. 36) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 17:25:44 -0000, "Henry" <henry RemoveThis @home.com> wrote:

>What I don't want in *no* VF at all - which seems to be a growing trend, I
>couldn't bear holding out the camera at arm's length to see the shot on the
>rear LCD (although lots of people seem perfectly happy with that
>arrangement)

While I agree that just an LCD only viewfinder would be unusually limiting at
times, don't discount some of the things it can be used for.

One excellent example is when trying to take macro-photos of insects in flight.
I invented a technique for myself where I set the focus manually to about 2 feet
in front of the lens, using a tele-macro lens arrangement so I get a good
close-up but with lots of working distance. Then setting the f/stop about
halfway for a fairly deep DOF. By holding the camera with arms half extended and
looking in the LCD only, you can quickly swing the camera around in all 3
dimensions to accurately follow and frame that insect in flight as it's buzzing
around plants and flowers. Following its rapid movements while also keeping it
within the depth you've chosen for clear focus by moving the camera toward and
away from you too, just as fast as the insect is flying. I've obtained some
macro photos of insects in flight using this method that would be impossible
with an EVF or any optical viewfinder held to the eye.

Another method is to use the same technique as an advance image stabilization
system when you are in a moving vehicle that is shaking or any platform that is
moving far beyond what any IS system can compensate for. By using the inertia
and mass of the camera, you partially tense your arm muscles into a sort of
spring suspension while framing and focusing through the LCD. You can be riding
on the back of a bouncing snowmobile at 50 mph and still hold the camera
perfectly still once you get the hang of how it works. Learn to practice this
am-spring-balance method. Again, this is impossible to do by using an EVF or
optical viewfinder held to the face.

These are just two of the more extreme and impossible to duplicate examples
where an LCD may come in handy for you one day.

>
>My memories of EVF's are of fairly grainy images that gave you a general
>picture (no pun intended) of the scene, but were not much good for focus or
>detailed framing.

Framing is 100% accurate. Unlike all optical viewfinders which are never 100%
accurate, and any stray light entering from the back of the camera will offset
the exposure readings in any DSLR. But you might still be annoyed by some of the
lower resolution EVF displays, until you get used to them and find their
benefits.

I have also found a technique where you can use a pixelated EVF display to
improve manual focusing to where it is even faster and more accurate than using
an optical viewfinder. Think of the whole screen as a micro-prism, like you are
used to seeing as the small semi-circle in any SLR focusing screen. Now, think
of its properties in reverse. In an EVF when the details and contrasting edges
are in focus, those pixels will scintillate as they are individually lit and
darkened as the in-focus features pass over the EVF's pixels. Any areas not in
focus won't cause this scintillation effect because they are only gradually
lighting and darkening adjoining pixels. The exact opposite of what happens in a
micro-prism in an optical viewfinder.

Once you learn how to see this you'll wonder how you ever did without it. That
coarse and grainy image is more beneficial than you might first think. Instead
of wondering if just the center is in focus, as in an optical viewfinder (unless
its just a low-contrast and low-light frosted screen), you can rapidly see which
parts of your whole scene are in accurate focus in an EVF from this pixel
scintillation.

>
>Perhaps EVF's have improved in the last few years?, I suppose they must
>have.

Some have, some have not. But I have found that the more of them that I used,
the more ways I found to use them to my benefit, greatly increasing my chances
of getting the best shot. Some photos that I could have never accomplished at
all with an optical viewfinder in the past.

You'll find out, once you get the hang of it.

Think in new ways. Try new things.

I did. That's why I'll never care if any camera I own ever has an optical
viewfinder ever again. People can cry about the benefits of an optical
viewfinder all they want. Doesn't matter one bit to me. I know better now. They
don't.
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allr1

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Since: Feb 24, 2007
Posts: 20



(Msg. 37) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:21 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital (more info?)

henry DeleteThis @home.com (Henry) wrote:

" optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual control as possible,
decent lens. "

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hopefully you're aware that an optical
viewfinder on a P&S doesn't work the
way it does on a DSLR.
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Steve B

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Since: Apr 21, 2007
Posts: 35



(Msg. 38) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital, others (more info?)

"Henry" <henry.RemoveThis@home.com> wrote in message
news:5p61hjFplc17U1@mid.individual.net...
> Hi
>
>
> First, let me pre-empt the flame brigade by saying that I *have* done a
> lot of on-line research in an attempt to reach a decision - but I'd like
> some thoughts from people who might have hands-on experience.
>
> I've been using dslrs for about three years now - or rather *not* using
> them because I very often just can't face all the hassle of carting the
> necessary paraphernalia around with me.
>
> I know all the IQ advantages of a dslr over a P&S but I 'd still like
> something easily transportable and generally less 'fussy'
>
> So my question is, which is the *best* non-dslr camera out there below 500
> GBP??
>
> I'd define *best* for my purposes as
>
> 1 - image quality - the lowest noise possible up to 800 iso
>
> 2 - features - optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual control
> as possible, decent lens.
>
> 3 - size - doesn't have to be 'micro' but generally small and easy to
> carry around.
>
> 4 - build quality - as rugged as possible
>
> Brand is unimportant.
>
> Any thoughts or personal recommendations would be appreciated.
>
> TIA Henry
>
>
>

Everyone seems to be telling you to get an EVF long zoom P&S, but I'll tell
you from personal experience what the main problem with them is, not
resolution as a good auto focus sort of negates that requirement, it's the
sluggishness of the display. If you tried to use one at an air show you
would soon realise how hard it is to get any decent shots as compared with a
DSLR where nearly every shot is a keeper.
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Patrick H.

External


Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 7



(Msg. 39) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:50:58 -0000, "Steve B" <sbradsPUTTWENTYFOURHERE RemoveThis @ukfsn.org>
wrote:

>
>"Henry" <henry RemoveThis @home.com> wrote in message
>news:5p61hjFplc17U1@mid.individual.net...
>> Hi
>>
>>
>> First, let me pre-empt the flame brigade by saying that I *have* done a
>> lot of on-line research in an attempt to reach a decision - but I'd like
>> some thoughts from people who might have hands-on experience.
>>
>> I've been using dslrs for about three years now - or rather *not* using
>> them because I very often just can't face all the hassle of carting the
>> necessary paraphernalia around with me.
>>
>> I know all the IQ advantages of a dslr over a P&S but I 'd still like
>> something easily transportable and generally less 'fussy'
>>
>> So my question is, which is the *best* non-dslr camera out there below 500
>> GBP??
>>
>> I'd define *best* for my purposes as
>>
>> 1 - image quality - the lowest noise possible up to 800 iso
>>
>> 2 - features - optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual control
>> as possible, decent lens.
>>
>> 3 - size - doesn't have to be 'micro' but generally small and easy to
>> carry around.
>>
>> 4 - build quality - as rugged as possible
>>
>> Brand is unimportant.
>>
>> Any thoughts or personal recommendations would be appreciated.
>>
>> TIA Henry
>>
>>
>>
>
>Everyone seems to be telling you to get an EVF long zoom P&S, but I'll tell
>you from personal experience what the main problem with them is, not
>resolution as a good auto focus sort of negates that requirement, it's the
>sluggishness of the display. If you tried to use one at an air show you
>would soon realise how hard it is to get any decent shots as compared with a
>DSLR where nearly every shot is a keeper.
>

I swear, some of you DSLR advocates must be buying your P&S cameras in a Good
Will bin for $15, selecting models from 8 years ago that were thrown away for
obvious reasons.

Do yourself a favor so you don't look so ignorant and foolish sometime. Test any
of the newer models in the last 6 years.

Do you think I could follow, frame, and focus on an annoyed wasp in flight in an
EVF or LCD if the display was sluggish? In tele-macro mode at that? Where the
wasp is filling up a 3rd of the display? Really now. Think about it, okay? In a
P&S camera that was manufactured over 5 years ago too.

Now go do some real homework instead of just regurgitating what you've read
every other DSLR advocate ever say. Then come back and tell us how things really
are one day after you've wiped that obvious egg off your face. That's the
trouble with believing what you've been told on the web by some self-appointed
"pro" idiot. Someone who has actual experience will come along one day and make
you look like a fool if you repeat what you are not sure about and never
bothered to test it yourself.
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Daniel Silevitch

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Since: Oct 07, 2005
Posts: 442



(Msg. 40) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:50:58 -0000, Steve B <sbradsPUTTWENTYFOURHERE.TakeThisOut@ukfsn.org> wrote:
>
> Everyone seems to be telling you to get an EVF long zoom P&S, but I'll tell
> you from personal experience what the main problem with them is, not
> resolution as a good auto focus sort of negates that requirement, it's the
> sluggishness of the display. If you tried to use one at an air show you
> would soon realise how hard it is to get any decent shots as compared with a
> DSLR where nearly every shot is a keeper.

For something like an airshow, that's not at all true, as you can track
the planes through the viewfinder without any problem. Get a model with
fairly fast focussing (e.g. a Panasonic or a recent Canon), and airshow
photography with a superzoom is straightforward. I've taken plenty of
well-timed airshow shots with my FZ5.

EVFs do have some disadvantages:

* low resolution compared to an optical finder, which makes manual
focus more difficult
* Some lag, which makes photographing sudden action (as opposed
to tracking something and anticipating the right moment) harder.

In both cases, the limitations can be mitigated or eliminated with the
right techniques, but they are still things that need to be considered.

-dms
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allr1

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Since: Feb 24, 2007
Posts: 20



(Msg. 41) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital (more info?)

spamstopper DeleteThis @nomail.net (Patrick H.) wrote:

" I swear, some of you DSLR advocates must be buying your P&S cameras in
a Good Will bin for $15, selecting models from 8 years ago that were
thrown away for obvious reasons. "

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

They're intentionally comparing a rotten apple (Good Will bin P&S) to
they're expensive and
bothersome orange. (DSLR)

It helps them in their need to justify it.
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David J Taylor

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Since: Jul 27, 2007
Posts: 604



(Msg. 42) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 6:53 pm
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Steve B wrote:
[]
> Everyone seems to be telling you to get an EVF long zoom P&S, but
> I'll tell you from personal experience what the main problem with
> them is, not resolution as a good auto focus sort of negates that
> requirement, it's the sluggishness of the display. If you tried to
> use one at an air show you would soon realise how hard it is to get
> any decent shots as compared with a DSLR where nearly every shot is a
> keeper.

Steve,

The speed of response of the DSLR helps a lot in those circumstances -
having the left hand on the mechanical zoom ring for rapid framing, for
example. I can vouch for your observations. By the way, I have both
compact cameras and DSLR - the weight of my kit is almost the same
whichever combination I take (although that is two compact cameras to
cover the 24 - 432mm zoom range).

Cheers,
David
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Michael Meissner

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Since: Nov 05, 2007
Posts: 49



(Msg. 43) Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>photo>digital, others (more info?)

Doug McDonald <mcdonald.TakeThisOut@SnPoAM_scs.uiuc.edu> writes:

> Alfred Molon wrote:
> > In article <fglffj$8mk$1@news.ks.uiuc.edu>, Doug McDonald says...
> >
> >> What about macro range?
> > Compact cameras are generally speaking very well suited for macro
> > photography, because of the small sensor. Lots of DOF and no need to use
> > dedicated macro lenses.
>
> That's not the question. One can get DOF and exactly the same
> noise performance as a P&S with an SLR by stopping down.

At least until diffraction sets in.

--
Michael Meissner
email: mrmnews.TakeThisOut@the-meissners.org
http://www.the-meissners.org
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Wilba

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Since: May 28, 2007
Posts: 48



(Msg. 44) Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 1:52 am
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Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Henry wrote:
> Wilba wrote:
>> Henry wrote:
>>>
>>> 2 - features - optical viewfinder is a must-have as much manual
>>> control as possible, decent lens.
>>
>> I'm interested why an optical VF is a must-have?
>>
>> True, the electronic VF in my Olympus C-770 is a complete waste of time
>> for manually focusing on a subject, so if manual focus is an issue, it
>> makes sense (if it works better with an optical VF - I don't know).
>>
>> OTOH, having a histogram in the viewfinder is brilliant - something the
>> DSLR brigade seem not to appreciate. Smile
>
> Sorry - I unintentionally misled you. although an 'optical' (as in
> 'looking through glass') VF would be nice, I'm not averse to a good EVF.

Ah, OK. I suspect I'm not alone in that misunderstanding. Smile

> What I don't want in *no* VF at all - which seems to be a growing trend,
> I couldn't bear holding out the camera at arm's length to see the shot on
> the rear LCD (although lots of people seem perfectly happy with that
> arrangement)

Yeah, I'm with you on that one.

> My memories of EVF's are of fairly grainy images that gave you a general
> picture (no pun intended) of the scene, but were not much good for focus
> or detailed framing.

The lack of resolution and clarity do make it difficult, but for me it's
more the focus mechanism that makes it pretty much impossible to manually
focus my C-770. With a focus ring on the lens you at least have a chance.

If my next camera isn't a DSLR, it will have focus and zoom rings on the
lens (like the Panasonic DMC-FZ50, for instance).

> Perhaps EVF's have improved in the last few years?, I suppose they must
> have.

I hope and expect so.
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David J. Littleboy

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Since: Aug 26, 2005
Posts: 1149



(Msg. 45) Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 1:52 am
Post subject: Re: Decent alternative to dslr? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Michael Meissner" <meissner RemoveThis @the-meissners.org> wrote:
> Doug McDonald <mcdonald RemoveThis @SnPoAM_scs.uiuc.edu> writes:
>
>> Alfred Molon wrote:
>> > In article <fglffj$8mk$1@news.ks.uiuc.edu>, Doug McDonald says...
>> >
>> >> What about macro range?
>> > Compact cameras are generally speaking very well suited for macro
>> > photography, because of the small sensor. Lots of DOF and no need to
>> > use
>> > dedicated macro lenses.
>>
>> That's not the question. One can get DOF and exactly the same
>> noise performance as a P&S with an SLR by stopping down.
>
> At least until diffraction sets in.

Diffraction bites you at different f stops, depending on the format. (This
is because with digital, one tends to have the same resolution in lines per
height (i.e. similar MP counts) across different formats.)

This means that you can use much smaller apertures on dSLRs than P&S
cameras. The 5D produces critically sharp images at f/16, while you can't
stop down below f/5.6 on many P&S cameras.

http://www.clarkvision.com/photoinfo/dof_myth/

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan
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