Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f..

drelliot DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote:
> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> surfers from the beach? Thanks!
>
Depends on how far away the surfers are and how good is good enough for
your particular application.
To get an IDEA of what the camera will see, look thru a pair of 8 -10X
power Binoculars.
They should have 400-500mm lenses.
Most 12X Zooms have max. focal length of 432mm
Bob Williams
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Thanks!

I'm just looking for some ballpark figures.

Yes--it's the 12x zoom 10 mp panasonic.

I was just wondeirng what others might have used for successful surfing
prhotography form the shore.

Thanks!

Best,

Elliot


Bob Williams wrote:
> drelliot.RemoveThis@gmail.com wrote:
> > Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> > surfers from the beach? Thanks!
> >
> Depends on how far away the surfers are and how good is good enough for
> your particular application.
> To get an IDEA of what the camera will see, look thru a pair of 8 -10X
> power Binoculars.
> They should have 400-500mm lenses.
> Most 12X Zooms have max. focal length of 432mm
> Bob Williams
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot.TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:
> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> surfers from the beach? Thanks!

That is sort of asking if a car is good enough if it has a speedometer
that goes up to 120 mph and a 20 gallon gas tank.

We need a little more information about the camera (make and model would
be nice) and your needs. What I would want for a beach camera may be far
different than you would. Finally there are question about your camera
experience and the quality results you are expecting?

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:

> Thanks!
>
> I'm just looking for some ballpark figures.
>
> Yes--it's the 12x zoom 10 mp panasonic.
>
> I was just wondeirng what others might have used for successful surfing
> prhotography form the shore.

This image was done at 420 mm on a 1.3x crop sensor:
http://www.clarkvision.com/galleries/gallery.hawaii/web/hawaii.wave.c1...1.2004.

The curl is about 6 feet, so a surfer would have been
a nice addition. I have photographed surfers from Hawaii
to Australia with a 300 mm lens + 1.4x TC = 420 mm
on 1.3x crop sensor which equates to 546 mm on 35mm.
(none are online)

In your case, I think the camera is 420 mm equivalent, so would
be a little less than above. If you can get close enough,
you could get some nice images.

A small sensor camera has two issues: shutter lag, and
signal to noise. See this test which compares various
images:

A Photographic Image Quality Test Using the Moon
http://www.clarkvision.com/imagedetail/moon-test1

It shows you can get quite nice images from the small sensor
cameras, just you can't enlarge the image as much as those from
a DSLR. The other issue is can you get a fast enough
shutter speed with adequate signal-to-noise? The above
image was done at 1/2000 second at f/5.6 at ISO 160.
That should be possible with with the FZ series cameras,
with S/N differences like on the moon test page above.
Shutter lag may be a frustration though in such a fast
action sport.

Roger
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot.TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:
> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> surfers from the beach? Thanks!
>

Well, it is better than no zoom, but without a good IS, you might not
get stable enough pictures for good use. 12X is pretty good for a zoom.
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot.TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:

> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for
> shooting surfers from the beach? Thanks!

As others have already said essentially what I will say. It depends
totally on your definition of "good enough". My sister has a Canon
PowerShot S3 IS with a 12x optical zoom and 6.0 mega pixels. She
loves her camera and is extremely happy with both its zoom ability
and its overall performance. She showed me a crop from one of her
images that let her read a license plate from what I would estimate
to be about 150 meters away. IMHO 12x would probably produce images
that are "big enough" if you are not too far away. OTOH, I would be
very unhappy if my only camera were one like hers. At full zoom, her
camera shows a very marked loss of contrast, colour fringing, lack of
edge definition and other problems. To my eye, no P&S camera can
give "good enough" results. That's why I have a Canon dSLR and all
"L" lenses. Like I said at the beginning, it depends totally on your
personal definition of "good enough".
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

Mardon wrote:
> drelliot.DeleteThis@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for
>> shooting surfers from the beach? Thanks!
>
> As others have already said essentially what I will say. It depends
> totally on your definition of "good enough". My sister has a Canon
> PowerShot S3 IS with a 12x optical zoom and 6.0 mega pixels. She
> loves her camera and is extremely happy with both its zoom ability
> and its overall performance. She showed me a crop from one of her
> images that let her read a license plate from what I would estimate
> to be about 150 meters away. IMHO 12x would probably produce images
> that are "big enough" if you are not too far away. OTOH, I would be
> very unhappy if my only camera were one like hers. At full zoom, her
> camera shows a very marked loss of contrast, colour fringing, lack
> of
> edge definition and other problems. To my eye, no P&S camera can
> give "good enough" results. That's why I have a Canon dSLR and all
> "L" lenses. Like I said at the beginning, it depends totally on
> your
> personal definition of "good enough".

If the OP ever gets a chance to observe surfsport photographers at
work, he will see they have even more stringent requirements than do
birders. They use BIG LONG lenses (600mm and up) and super-sturdy
tripods.

I used a Nikon CP8700 with add-on telephoto extender, equivalent to
about 480mm, if I recall correctly. From the beach, it made nice
scenics of waves and athletes on boards. From the pier it showed a few
pretty well-filled frames. All that to indicate you either get a BIG
LONG lens, or you get close.

Local conditions may vary, but most surfside atmosphere is heavy with
humidity, and even the best lenses' production is often degraded.

It's another case of "If you intend making a career of it, it requires
serious investment of study and equipment". A casual shooter might be
satisfied with what comes out of a 12x small-sensor camera, but it
won't measure up to what shows up in the magazines.

--
Frank ess
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

Joseph Meehan wrote:
> drelliot.TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:
>> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for
>> shooting surfers from the beach? Thanks!
>
> That is sort of asking if a car is good enough if it has a
> speedometer that goes up to 120 mph and a 20 gallon gas tank.
>
> We need a little more information about the camera (make and model
> would be nice) and your needs. What I would want for a beach camera
> may be far different than you would. Finally there are question
> about your camera experience and the quality results you are
> expecting?

Rereading your message I see I did not properly read it. You want to do
surfers from the beach. Well two points. 12X does not mean what most
people might think it means. It is not like binoculars where a 12X
binocular would make something appear 12 times closer. What it means is
something will appear 12 times larger at the long end than the short end.
However they usually have a wide angle on the short end so the long end is
often something like 6 times larger than normal would be. That will vary
depending on the camera.

You will be able to get some good photos with the typical such camera,
but it will not be anywhere close to the kind of results you might see in
magazines etc, where they photographers are using lenses that cost far more
than any camera you are looking at.

Some places you can get some very nice shoots close to shore (depends on
the surf) so at those locations the equipment becomes less important.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

In article <g8pIg.7611$Mz3.5736@fed1read07>,
Bob Williams <mytbob RemoveThis @cox.nospam.net> wrote:

> drelliot RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:
> > Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> > surfers from the beach? Thanks!
> >
> Depends on how far away the surfers are and how good is good enough for
> your particular application.
> To get an IDEA of what the camera will see, look thru a pair of 8 -10X
> power Binoculars.
> They should have 400-500mm lenses.
> Most 12X Zooms have max. focal length of 432mm
> Bob Williams

Also keep in mind that the 12x starts from wide-angle. My camera has a
6x optical zoom from 35-210mm equiv. So that's only around 4x actual
magnification.
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:
> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> surfers from the beach? Thanks!

12x what?

Tell us the 35mm equivalent of your lens. 12x could mean an equivalent
of 12mm - 144mm. You can go very wide, but only medium telephoto. So
who knows?

If you really want to photograph surfers from the beach, though, you
need a heck of a lens. Some guys use telescopes.
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

Today, made these interesting comments ...

> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for
> shooting surfers from the beach? Thanks!
>
I don't know, is it? You are only one who would know if that is
good enough or not. But, if your real question is whether 12X is a
long enough telephoto and can't find more, which I would believe,
then shoot at the max MP and crop out the surfer from the middle

--
HP, aka Jerry

Member, Chrysler Employee Motorsport Association (CEMA)
http://www.cemaclub.org/default.html
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

Thanks!

You've all been very helpful!

OK--now here comes the second part.

I am going to shoot surfers professionally--what kind of equipment
should I buy?

Lets' say I have $1,000, $2,000, and $3,000.

What would you take to the beach if you were going to shoot surfers?

Thanks!


Frank ess wrote:
> Mardon wrote:
> > drelliot DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote:
> >
> >> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for
> >> shooting surfers from the beach? Thanks!
> >
> > As others have already said essentially what I will say. It depends
> > totally on your definition of "good enough". My sister has a Canon
> > PowerShot S3 IS with a 12x optical zoom and 6.0 mega pixels. She
> > loves her camera and is extremely happy with both its zoom ability
> > and its overall performance. She showed me a crop from one of her
> > images that let her read a license plate from what I would estimate
> > to be about 150 meters away. IMHO 12x would probably produce images
> > that are "big enough" if you are not too far away. OTOH, I would be
> > very unhappy if my only camera were one like hers. At full zoom, her
> > camera shows a very marked loss of contrast, colour fringing, lack
> > of
> > edge definition and other problems. To my eye, no P&S camera can
> > give "good enough" results. That's why I have a Canon dSLR and all
> > "L" lenses. Like I said at the beginning, it depends totally on
> > your
> > personal definition of "good enough".
>
> If the OP ever gets a chance to observe surfsport photographers at
> work, he will see they have even more stringent requirements than do
> birders. They use BIG LONG lenses (600mm and up) and super-sturdy
> tripods.
>
> I used a Nikon CP8700 with add-on telephoto extender, equivalent to
> about 480mm, if I recall correctly. From the beach, it made nice
> scenics of waves and athletes on boards. From the pier it showed a few
> pretty well-filled frames. All that to indicate you either get a BIG
> LONG lens, or you get close.
>
> Local conditions may vary, but most surfside atmosphere is heavy with
> humidity, and even the best lenses' production is often degraded.
>
> It's another case of "If you intend making a career of it, it requires
> serious investment of study and equipment". A casual shooter might be
> satisfied with what comes out of a 12x small-sensor camera, but it
> won't measure up to what shows up in the magazines.
>
> --
> Frank ess
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f.. 

drelliot RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:
> Is 12x optical zoom on a 10 mp digital camera good enough for shooting
> surfers from the beach? Thanks!

You'll run into the age-old problem of shutter lag and frame speed if
you're expecting to do action photography.

Digital SLR sales would plunge if a P&S digital ever could approach the
same shutter lag and frame speed. I was just talking to my nephew last
night, who's daughter is a gymnast, and he's finally going to get a
digital SLR because it's just hopeless to do sports photography with a
point and shoot.

Your real question should be whether you should get a Canon or Nikon
digital SLR!
 >> Stay informed about: Is 12x optical zoom ona 10 mp digital camera good enough f..